Technical Question about '56 Ford Club Sedan Thunderbird-312 or 292?

[Nighthawk756]

I have a 56 Ford F100 that I bought with no engine. I wanted to get the best y block I could find locally to rebuild and put in it. So that leads me to today....there's a vintage/classic junkyard close to me that I wondered around today and I have a question about what I'm buying from him.

He had a y block that was already out but using the handy tech info that I printed out from Y BLock Guy's site before I went, the casting numbers showed it was a 272. So I moved on....he had a 1956 Ford Club Sedan with the y block still in it. I popped the hood and noticed it had a 4 barrel on it. I then noticed it had Thunderbird badges on the front fenders.

What can you tell me about that engine? 292 or 312? My friend seems to think there's a good chance it could be a 312 but I'm thinking it's just a 292 for a couple of reasons....the casting number by the distributor is EDB with what looks like 17 above it. Also, I found a website that showed the "thunderbird" model sedans had 292's with holley 4 barrels.

I really appreciate anything anyone can tell me....it would be
fantastic if it's a 312 but I'll be almost as happy if it isn't. I just need to
find a set of G heads, good cam and headers to slap on it!!

[Atwater Mike]

Not so, (theT-Bird marqued sedans being 'all 292s')

Look at the vehicle number plate inside the drivers door: the first character will designate engine size. "U" is 272, "M" is 292, "P" is 312.

My good friend had a blue-and-white '56 'Custom', tudor post. It had an interior red light and police radio brackets, and was a 'P' designation. Factory 312. 'Felony sleeper'...
After I tuned it, Zowie!

[56don]

My first car had a "Thunderbird Special" in a 56 Club Sedan. It was a 292 4 barrel,but they did put 312s in them. Like Mike said, check the code on the plate. But, any car that old in a salvage yard may have had the engine replaced many years ago. A 292 would be cheaper to rebuild and probably run just as hard with the right modifications.

[guthriesmith]

Mine which is the same exact car is a 292, but checking the engine code as mentioned above is the best way to know (at least what came in the car).

[Nighthawk756]

Ok, thanks guys....unfortunately the data plate was gone many moons ago. I checked the drivers door before I left to help me identify it but no go. The literature I have shows an EDB casting number as being a 58-59. But the guy swears it's a 56. It looks to be the original motor, but anything sitting that long could look that way.

I'm gonna buy it anyway....it won't hurt my feelings if it's a 292. I plan on getting a set of G heads, a good cam and headers. Along with a rebuild of course. Would you suggest a better 4 barrel and/or intake? I hear those stockers arent the best.

What could I be looking at HP wise with those mods? Anywhere near 300?

[guthriesmith]

I can attest to the headaches of the original 4-barrel carburetor after it giving me fits driving 300 or so miles to and from the Stray Kat 500 show this past weekend. I can't hardly wait to get it off and replaced with my 3x2 setup (which could open up a whole new set of problems). Anyway, my understanding of the teapots is that they are more trouble than they are worth...

[Fortunateson]

I have a 292 for my '56 Meteor hardtop. I was told that on the front left of the engine, I think near where the wp mounts there is a serial number. Apparently you can tell by that. I've forgotten the exact details since as soon as I knew mine was a 292 I "edited" that info from my tiny brain!

[56don]

You could try to find a 57 four barrel intake with a 57 up distributor then you could run a regular holley on it. My old teapot carb never gave me any trouble in four years of running it all over the southeast but the car was only 8 years old when I got it.

[Lowriders Art Gallery]

I've had the best luck with the 57 to 64 2bbl intakes. The carbs will interchange clear into the 90's. The rear main seal will be your first clue as to a 292 or 312. Rope was used for the 312 gaskets. Neoprene gaskets are available for the 292's. 312's are like Chevy 350's, everyone came out of a Corvette. 90% of the Fords were 272's or 292's, but everybody you talk to had a 312.

[Nighthawk756]

Great stuff guys! I appreciate it....only one true way to tell which it is....and that's yank it out and check the crank and/or mains. The rear seal sounds like a quick way once it's out....thanks for the info LAG.

And thanks everyone for the carb/intake advice.

[Nighthawk756]

Hmmmm, according to Mummert's website, EDB is a '57 if cast at Dearborn....so that might mean I may very well already have G heads right? And he says Dearborn's casting numbers are by the distribuotr and that's where mine is.

Interesting, can't wait to get it out and see....

[Nighthawk756]

Got the engine finally. It's an EDB DIF casting by the distributor and EDB-6015-A by the generator. And according to Mummert that makes it a 57....but the heads are ECZ-B which is a '56 number. Who knows man.... Still haven't had time to pull the bellhousing and pan to look at the crank flange and mains but I'll get that done soon so I can at least eliminate it as a 312 or confirm it....whichever it may be(probably the former).

On a side note....I found an ECG 272 longblock for a hundred bucks near me that has 113 heads on it. I'm buying it this weekend to use the 113's on mine.

[NMCarNut]

While it sounds like you may have a later motor you do not need the patent plate to verify what engine the car originally came with. The first digit of the serial number identifies the engine. The serial number is stamped on the top of the right frame rail in the area just below the firewall.

Originally Posted by Nighthawk756

Ok, thanks guys....unfortunately the data plate was gone many moons ago. I checked the drivers door before I left to help me identify it but no go. The literature I have shows an EDB casting number as being a 58-59. But the guy swears it's a 56. It looks to be the original motor, but anything sitting that long could look that way.

I'm gonna buy it anyway....it won't hurt my feelings if it's a 292. I plan on getting a set of G heads, a good cam and headers. Along with a rebuild of course. Would you suggest a better 4 barrel and/or intake? I hear those stockers arent the best.

What could I be looking at HP wise with those mods? Anywhere near 300?

[Nighthawk756]

Looks like it's definitely a 56. It has 56 heads and 56 intake.

No biggy, especially since I found the 113 heads that I plan on using. Plus, there is ONE upside to the motor....it has the high ratio rockers! I was pretty pleased when I popped the cover off and saw the ECG rockers!!

I appreciate it CarNut....unfortunately the car is still in the salvage yard. If I get back out there, I'll check on the frame rail now that the motor's out.

[50Fraud]

The '57 4-bbl and distributor are a huge improvement over the '56. MUCH healthier! The '57 parts will fit the '56 manifold without any modification.

[Nighthawk756]

Originally Posted by 50Fraud

The '57 4-bbl and distributor are a huge improvement over the '56. MUCH healthier! The '57 parts will fit the '56 manifold without any modification.

I'm hearing that the 57 manifold is better too??

[famdoc3]

There are lots of people out there who think the 113 heads are better than the Gs. Dump the teapot. I ran a pair of them on my T'bird for years and they needed frequent attention to keep them leak free. You can use the '57 cast iron which is the first year for the modern square bore holley. Don't go to big with the Holley stay down around 550 cfm or so and you will have a great running rock solid reliable motor. You do need to upgrade to the 57 distributor. The really early (before 57) aren't nearly as good. If it turns out you do have a 312 there is now a good neoprene rear seal. Watch the damned valley pan installation as those things just love to be warped and then they leak.

[Nighthawk756]

Originally Posted by famdoc3

There are lots of people out there who think the 113 heads are better than the Gs. Dump the teapot. I ran a pair of them on my T'bird for years and they needed frequent attention to keep them leak free. You can use the '57 cast iron which is the first year for the modern square bore holley. Don't go to big with the Holley stay down around 550 cfm or so and you will have a great running rock solid reliable motor. You do need to upgrade to the 57 distributor. The really early (before 57) aren't nearly as good. If it turns out you do have a 312 there is now a good neoprene rear seal. Watch the damned valley pan installation as those things just love to be warped and then they leak.

Thanks Fam! Great info....I've really grown to love these quirky engines!!

[50Fraud]

Originally Posted by Nighthawk756

I'm hearing that the 57 manifold is better too??

It may well be. I had a 312 out of a '56 Merc in my '55 Ford, and a friend offered me his takeoff '57 carb and dizzy. I just bolted them on without changing the manifold, and it absolutely WOKE UP my engine. I think that upgrade made more seat-of-the-pants power than the change from 272 to 312.

This all took place around 1966, so my recollection of it is a little bit old and wrinkled.

[Nighthawk756]

Originally Posted by 50Fraud

It may well be. I had a 312 out of a '56 Merc in my '55 Ford, and a friend offered me his takeoff '57 carb and dizzy. I just bolted them on without changing the manifold, and it absolutely WOKE UP my engine. I think that upgrade made more seat-of-the-pants power than the change from 272 to 312.

This all took place around 1966, so my recollection of it is a little bit old and wrinkled.

Thanks Fraud! I'm surprised you can remember that much from that long ago....I'm lucky to remember what I did last week!