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Technical Transmission help

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by sschreiner5, May 6, 2015.

  1. sschreiner5
    Joined: Aug 30, 2011
    Posts: 19

    sschreiner5
    Member
    from Minnesota

    We have a 57 Olds 88 with a 371v8 and an automatic transmission. The pan says Hydra Matic and the service manual calls it a Jetaway transmission. The problem started all of a sudden, we came a round a corner and it was like it was in neutral, the engine would rev up but the car would not accelerate. Once the car slowed down it shifted back into first and we could accelerate again but it would not shift out of first until we let off the gas but then it was like we were in neutral again. We can't tell if it isn't shifting all the way into second or if second is just slipping. I think it doesn't shift all the way into second like theres a stuck valve or something, The fluid was about 2 quarts low and its brown, its not black but it isnt pink either. I dont think its slipping in second because it just started all of a sudden not gradually got worse. Second gear is just like neutral theres no jerking or pulling at all. It doesnt slip at all in first or reverse. Is this a sign this trans needs a rebuild? We plan to change the fluid to see if that helps. What else should we do? If it is a stuck valve is fresh fluid going to help? Is there something else we can do with the trans in the car?
     
  2. sschreiner5
    Joined: Aug 30, 2011
    Posts: 19

    sschreiner5
    Member
    from Minnesota

  3. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    Check fluid for correct levels. Next check the TV rod to make sure it is still functioning correctly. This is the rod going from carb to transmission. If all is well up to this point, then try driving in LO. This should make the transmission start in first and then go to 2nd. This uses the LO band in place of the sprags and small fluid coupling. If the transmission goes to 2nd then the small fluid coupling is not filling. This could be governor or valve body causing this.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  4. sschreiner5
    Joined: Aug 30, 2011
    Posts: 19

    sschreiner5
    Member
    from Minnesota

    Thanks, the fluid was low so we topped it off but that didn't help. The fluid is brown so we are changing it. I think it acted the same way in lo that it did in D and S but we will check again. The tv linkage looks ok. What else can we do?
     

  5. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    Try changing "all" the fluid, including draining the big fluid coupling near the flywheel. While the pan is off see what kind of gunk is at the bottom of the pan. If there are chunks of friction material in the pan, then it looks like a rebuild is in order. If no chunks in pan, and trying it with the new fluid and still no go, then it might be necessary to check the governor to see if it is stuck. You will have to remove the rear housing to get to governor.
     
    40fordtudor likes this.
  6. yep d2 knows. ;)
     
  7. sschreiner5
    Joined: Aug 30, 2011
    Posts: 19

    sschreiner5
    Member
    from Minnesota

    Ok thanks. I know how to get all the fluid out. If we do have to mess with the governor how would we get it unstuck? Just remove, clean and reinstall? We have a service manual so I think we can figure out how to get it out.
     
  8. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    Governors can be cleaned to a certain extent. What you will be looking for is the G-1 port to make sure that the weights are free to move. G-1 controls the 1-2 shift, while the G-2 is for 2-3 and 3-4 shifts. The G-1 weight might not be removable. If it is stuck and solvents don't free it up, then a replacement will be necessary.

    I have a 60 Olds Jetaway that is for sale. $100 + shipping.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  9. sschreiner5
    Joined: Aug 30, 2011
    Posts: 19

    sschreiner5
    Member
    from Minnesota

    Thanks! What condition is your trans in? Is it for parts or is it working?
     
  10. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    It is all there, and when I drained it, the fluid was nice red color. My guess is that it might be good, but really don't know. Here are some pics

    59 Olds Jetaway.JPG

    60 Jetaway for sale.JPG
     
  11. dirty old man
    Joined: Feb 2, 2008
    Posts: 8,910

    dirty old man
    Member Emeritus

    • That Jetaway began being oem in 1956 and before the year was over, there wasn't an automotive writer who was in the least performance oriented anywhere who hadn't either publicly or privately said that the Jetaway was a real bummer when compared to it's predecessor, the dual range hyda-matic for performance, durability and repairability after being driven hard. Their were smoother shifts, etc. but high performance use was a real bummer.
    • I think I would put my efforts into somehow going back to the old hydra-matic dual range, or updating to a turbo 350 or 400.
     
  12. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    Yes, going back to the dual range single coupling hydramatic is a possibility. The Turbos would need modification by Tony at Ross Racing. If the OP is just needing to drive the car and not race it, the Jetaway will work just fine.
     
  13. sschreiner5
    Joined: Aug 30, 2011
    Posts: 19

    sschreiner5
    Member
    from Minnesota

    First off thanks for all the help.
    Yes we just want to drive it, we just cruise and don't try to break any speed records or race it. We changed all the fluid and that didn't help at all. There wasn't any chunks in the pan and the fluid really didn't look that bad. I'm pretty sure we got most of the fluid out as we had to pour in 11 quarts to fill it back up. We didn't try to mess with anything else after the fluid change as looking at what it would take to get the governor we weren't sure if we would need any new gaskets or special tools. It looks like there is a rear oil pump and a reverse piston we would need to remove.... What would we need to get to the governor out and back in, any gaskets or o rings? I looks the yoke will need to be removed or is the output shaft going to come out (the manual we have is not clear on this). I have a 700r4 just laying around that I believe to be in working order but I'm not sure what it would take to get it in there so thats kinda the last resort. If we cant fix it in the car we are thinking we might just want to find someone to rebuild the jetaway but how would we find someone in the twin cities MN area? We found a rebuild kit online somewhere for $300 but Im not sure your average tranny shop would know how to rebuild this one.
     
  14. czuch az
    Joined: Dec 12, 2014
    Posts: 161

    czuch az

    Look for a tranny with the proverbial Old guy. Probably a grumpy one too..
    There are places that arent afraid of old cars. Ask around, like at a real parts house.
    Not the one with the chick with all the proper piercings who cant find a kit for a Holley 2100.
    I always wanted to open a "Pre 73, bring it to me" garage.
    I had one rebuilt in an OT truck and it was $1200, and I took the tyransmission out.
     
  15. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    Let me check it out. I don't think it is a big job. The driveshaft comes out first. Then the extension housing. After that I would think the governor is right there. I will get back to you on the procedure.
     
  16. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    The governor removal is not a big job. In fact it might just be stuck and all you would have to do is remove the driveshaft and extension housing. Biggest issue I see is the oil cooler lines being in the way. You will need at least the extension housing gasket. There might be an o-ring for the oil cooler adapter too.

    When you go to check the governor you will need to make sure that both G1 and G2 spring loaded plungers are free to move. Check the springs too, they may be broken.

    If you need parts, try FATSCO. They should be able to help you out.

    Check the following link for more:
    http://www.pontiacsafari.com/Hydramatic/1957/index.htm
     
  17. sschreiner5
    Joined: Aug 30, 2011
    Posts: 19

    sschreiner5
    Member
    from Minnesota

    Thanks. We will check it out. The oil cooler lines are towards the front of the transmission: upload_2015-6-2_11-23-50.png
    Why would they be in the way? I must be missing something.
     
  18. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    I think the 57 manual said something about them. If not in the way, then no problem.
     
  19. sschreiner5
    Joined: Aug 30, 2011
    Posts: 19

    sschreiner5
    Member
    from Minnesota

    Ok we finally got back to this one and its shifting fine now. The G1 weight was a little tough to turn so we cleaned it off until it moved freely then reinstalled it. The 1-2 shift is really nice now, I guess we had an issue that was slowly getting worse until it wouldn't shift and just didn't notice. We expected slow shifts with this old trans anyway.

    Thanks for all the help! We are cruising again!
     
  20. The few Hydramatics I've driven, that I suspect were in good working order, tended to have quite solid, noticeable upshifts. To the extent that if you were only used to later model transmissions, you might suspect that they were trying to self-destruct. I think that's the way they were supposed to feel. They shouldn't rattle your fillings loose but you should definitely feel them shift, even at lighter throttle driving. I seem to even remember feeling them downshift during coast-down if you were paying attention.
     
  21. dirty old man
    Joined: Feb 2, 2008
    Posts: 8,910

    dirty old man
    Member Emeritus

    ClayMart, you were most likely driving the dual range and earlier hydramatics built prior to the advent of the Jetaway slush boxes. Yes, you could feel every shift, up or down in the old style.
    GM smoothed and slowed the shift on the Jetaway, but lost the performance edge they hsd, plus smooth shifts mean slippage and consequent wear.
     
  22. Interesting and educational.
    Nice car and i'm glad you figured it out with help from the guys and fixed it yourself.
    Way to go "d2_willys"

    Happy motoring.
     
  23. Engine man
    Joined: Jan 30, 2011
    Posts: 3,480

    Engine man
    Member
    from Wisconsin

    Good to see it started working for you after the fluid change. I always recommend TransX. It can't replace worn parts but it does a great job of cleaning the varnish from the parts. It frees sticky valves and cleans slipping friction material.
     
  24. sschreiner5
    Joined: Aug 30, 2011
    Posts: 19

    sschreiner5
    Member
    from Minnesota

    Yeah thanks everyone especially d2 Willys! We were thinking we'd miss back to the 50s (huge car show in town) this year. But thanks to the hamb the Olds is gonna make it. The way it shifts now is pretty good but it doesn't compare to today's modern trannys.
     
  25. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    Have a great time at the car show. The older dual range hydramatic shifts harder than your Jetaway, but for cruising Jetaway will do just fine. Keep on cruisin!
     
  26. You're exactly right! ;) These were like '55 and older models. There's another Hydramatic thread or two going on at the moment and I forgot that this one was a Jetaway. I'm more than a little impressed that most of the newer automatics can shift as smoothly as they do and they generally aren't wearing themselves out. :eek:
     

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